Opinion

Arguing the point

You and I see it every day on this blog. We're part of it, we're in the midst of it, and it may even be that we thrive on it. Argument. As you know some blog subjects attract more argument than others, and if you'd like to remind yourself of that have a flip through the Greta Blockade blog of a week ago. While you're flipping through it look for a conversion, the persuasion of an opponent to the other side.

Argument never seems to convert anyone, and so I wonder what the point of it is. I suppose I should be clear that I see a difference between argument and discussion - the former is debate between people of different opinion and the latter is an exchange between people of similar opinion. Well, I know that in theory people of different opinion should be capable of discussion, but the reality is that when opinions differ discussion quickly moves to argument.

In my column in The Herald today I suggest that one of the reasons argument fails to convert is that we tend to adopt opinions as a package of many opinions, with ready arguments and defences, and so the recanting of one opinion may require the recanting of a great many. Another reason may be that our package of opinions is chosen to fit our rung on the ladder, our station in life, the image we have of ourselves and we expect others have of us, and so a challenge to our opinion is a challenge to our space in society. Notice, by the way, how people change their package of opinions as they move up or down the rung, and the mass movement in recent years from working to middle class provided a fine example of that.

Argument allows us to refine our own position by testing our defences and drawing from the likeminded, and we find some gratification in battering the other side. Are they, though, the only points to argument? Is there any point at all?

Posted By: Jeff Corbett on 21/04/2010 5:44:00 PM | Comments (70)

Share on
Facebook

Tweet on
Twitter

Email to
a friend

comments

Date: Newest first | Oldest first

Old chinese proverb; He who wins the most arguments loses the most friends.

Posted by crusty, 22/04/2010 10:17:34 AM, on The Herald

Ok I will bait the hook and throw out the line.... The pro railers that are lobbying to keep the railway line into Newcastle Station are a great example of not wanting to listen to a counter argument....its got to be their way and no other way. All they have done is get the backs up of many people that may have at one time been persuaded to listen more intently to their argument including some that may have even turned over to their side.

Posted by Thinkitthrough, 22/04/2010 10:36:23 AM, on The Herald

check out on you tube the monty python skit (a john cleese classic) where a client pays for an argument. Champagne comedy. I have been convinced by some arguments/discussion points presented on here from time to time. It doesn't matter how much you know. There's ALWAYS someone who knows more. My only caveat on that is that i like fresh information to be presented with the siource cited, otherwise i'll take it with a grain of salt.

Posted by fista, 22/04/2010 10:42:09 AM, on The Herald

Jeff, what frustrates me the most is the 'shut up' arguments (like those from my mum) becasue she has no other argument (ie knows she is wrong). We recently had a debate about religion at the family Easter lunch (where I ate lamb...which started the whole religion conversation to start with). I have hundreds of reasons why the bible is nonsense, how Christians choose certain sections to 'follow' and ignore the remainder. I thought I had well reasoned arguments. However, my mum resorted to 'oh, shut up' arguments or 'when you are older you'll understand' (I'm in my mid 30's for Christ sake!!!) When mum resorted to the argument that we should follow the bible I said that was fine because the bible said that I was right - 1 Timothy 2:12 says that "I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent" - I told my mother to remain silent in my presence. Argument won!

Posted by Humpty, 22/04/2010 10:51:26 AM, on The Herald

nice crusty. Too true. The old Dale Carnegie mantra "nobody wins an argument" still holds true. Fight the fights that need fighting, and let everything else go through to Gilly. ...except on blogs of course. This is serious stuff that requires no backing down. lol

Posted by fista, 22/04/2010 10:55:33 AM, on The Herald

I'm not in an argumentive mood today, so i'll just have a discussion. But the other party may want to argue the point, where does that leave me. Thump, bash, bang, now do you see my point.

Posted by intouch, 22/04/2010 11:00:56 AM, on The Herald

Idon't normally argue, but when I do I never use a glass or knife to make my point.

Posted by intouch, 22/04/2010 11:05:34 AM, on The Herald

Humpty - you actually did not win that argument with your mum, because you (and I know) place the bible to be bull****, so you relying upon a verse within that document supports her more than supports you. For the REAL truth you need Scientology - ask Scott Hillard for a discourse and free e-meter audit.

Posted by Lazarus, 22/04/2010 11:19:34 AM, on The Herald

Jeff - you should well know that you shouldn't have a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.

Posted by Black Knight, 22/04/2010 11:20:32 AM, on The Herald

You made me think about this whole thing a bit, intouch... So what's the difference between a debate and an argument? Is it just the social status of those involved or their chosen weapons of argument?

Posted by crusty, 22/04/2010 11:32:51 AM, on The Herald