i have just recently read a novel by Bryce Courtenay called Four Fires. one of the characters tells at length about fighting fires in the country. it should be mandatory reading for all Australians as it presents factual information about the nature of fires and what it is like to fight a fire, in a way that is unforgettable.

and yes, police should be empowered to order any civilian considered to be at risk from fire to be removed from the property asap. but then imagine the pictures if that had to be done by force. the media would have a field day depicting screaming, crying home owners and their children being removed for their own safety at the hands of police who would be villified by the story.

The official guidelines are deadly for today's bushfires. Property before people - for the good of the insurance companies.

The problem with the 'evacuation' idea is that, in order to be effective, you really need to have left the premises many hours before the fire gets there.... at the minute we have around 40 fires in Australia, and a southerly on the east coast, at any minute a change in wind could alter those fires significantly - how do we go about evacuating the many tens of thousands of households within 25kms of every fire ???? or do we wait till the situation becomes 'serious' enough near one of those fires - the problem then would be that, by the time people realise they need to evacuate, its already too late - many more would be killed trying to escape the fire. Another issue is resourcing - when many hundreds of people are fighting a blaze, roads are choked with smokeand falling trees, and there are many many houses scattered throughout any particular area - it takes a lot of manpower to go onto every property and order evacuation!

I don't think making rash comments or making judgements on people that have just lost everything is the right thing. From listening to interviews, no-one was prepared for such a fury of fire and weather. There is talk of homes exploding or areas exploding in fire. That isn't just a general bushfire where you have hours or days to work out whether to leave or not. These poor people had no time. This is a tragedy beyond anyone's comprehension.

Clare, its got nothing to do with protecting property over people - its about finding the safest place for the people (and insurance companies have no say in making that decision)if you have ever lived in bushfire prone areas and survived through fire (I have) then you know that time and time again it has been proven that it is (usually) much safer to be in a house than trying to run/drive away from the fire. The key is making sure that the house/property is well prepared - and with current planning requiremnts ALL houses in rural areas are subject to a formal bushfire threat assessment and are constructed so as to resist fire (spark guards, enclosed eaves, no open timberwork, no gaps in verandahs etc). In many cases, the only thing left standing is the house. Last time my friend had a fire go through (Cessnock way) everything outside the house was destroyed, right down to the copper logs in the garden (not 2 feet form the wall of the house) and the cars in the drive - yet the house stood. I think the problem with current firesin Vic is that they were more ferocious and fast moving than ever before and because of this noone had a chance! Evacuation is only an option if done many hours earlier - and that has problems (as pointed out in my previous post above). Many people were killed in hosues in Vic - but from the photos and reports of people dying in cars trying to escape you can see how much chaos there was from people trying to escape.

I reckon the cops should be able to order evacs, with the help/advice of the fire fighters. Sure, there are times when there just ain't time. Hats off to all those involved in fighting fires. Is there a role for much tighter planning controls / approval criteria for housing in bushfire prone areas? Gawd knows the planners love putting rules over everything else ~ why can't they use thir power for good instead of evil, and create some practical, useful guidelines for housing in busgfire prone areas? Some elements could include : (a) when / where housing should be prohibited (b) what housing should look like if approved in marginal areas (materials, water tanks, setbacks to bush/trees etc) and (c) annual certification to make sure trees & bushes are cleared close to homes, water tanks & flow systems are still working etc. maybe some of this sort of stuff already happens, but surely we can do it much much better, so residents KNOW they can stay in their firesafe house in the event of a fire.....

Jeff, in NSW Police already have the power to remove people if a State of Emergency is issued. I was part off Rural Bushfire Brigade for a few years. I have witnessed first hand fire storms where the trees actually explode before the fire hits them. I have never seen anything like whats been happening in VIC. It was the luck of the draw, no stopping it, no running from it. The power of it is uncontrolable. I feel praise for those working the fire, and sorrow for those affected.

I don't think that there is any rules to what has happen in Victoria & NSW. No-one can rule which way the wind is going to blow, it can change in a split second & the way the people in Victoria have been speaking they said it was moving that fast that they had no time to do anything, It's not just people in houses that were affected, people trying to get away in cars are the major casualties... Personally, this is one of the saddest thing I have seen in my life. One thing I will say is that back burning around properties in the colder season is a must because the low lying plants are the fuel for a fire & that can prevent such tragedies happening in such a major scale.

Perhaps more emphasis needs to be put on placing enforced firebreaks around housing or at least townships.